Could someone make a list of FreeBASIC GUI libraries/frameworks?

For other topics related to the FreeBASIC project or its community.
deltarho[1859]
Posts: 2916
Joined: Jan 02, 2017 0:34
Location: UK

Re: Could someone make a list of FreeBASIC GUI libraries/frameworks?

Postby deltarho[1859] » Apr 18, 2020 4:32

I am surprised that no one has mentioned José Roca's WinFBX framework yet which is 'wall to wall' SDK wrappers. I used it for Encrypternet. I have just mentioned in another thread that Paul Squire's WinFBE, IDE for Windows, is written in FreeBASIC and WinFBX. Looking at WinFBE's source code we see that when it comes to writing GUI's the only limiting factor to FreeBASIC and WinFBX is our imagination. Of course the ultimate to writing Windows GUIs is SDK programming using the Windows APIs but that is not a 'walk in the park' - WinFBX can get us to where we want a lot faster. The WinFBE editor has a lot of WinFBX templates to play with and a WinFBX framework Help. Do you want a dynamic Unicode null terminated string data type - WinFBX has one.
systemctl
Posts: 182
Joined: Mar 27, 2020 5:15

Re: Could someone make a list of FreeBASIC GUI libraries/frameworks?

Postby systemctl » Apr 18, 2020 7:30

marcov wrote:
I think we really need a good GUI designer but I don't think we need RAD.


Like what ? One could say I never saw a good GUI designer then, but that is maybe because I never looked because I was on the RAD train. The closest I got is Symantic Visual Cafe and JBuilder, which are RAD-like, but try to rescan source rather than doing it properly.


Glade, QtDesigner, wxGlade, wxSmith, wxFormBuilder, Eclipse Window Builder or Netbeans Swing GUI Designer? Does Visual Studio count as RAD? If not the GUI designer of it also good. SharpDevelop's GUI designer. PascalABC.NET's GUI designer. Too many.

From my definition it's only need to be able to build user interface without having to code by hand and allow us to bind even to like OnButtonClick, OnMouseOver... then it's enough to be a good GUI designer. RAD also includes non visible component you can drag and drop into the form that I strongly against and because of that I prefer a simple GUI designer without any non visible component. If I want to use a Timer I will call the Timer sub but not drag a non visible "TTimer" component and drop into my form. That's my reasoning.
systemctl
Posts: 182
Joined: Mar 27, 2020 5:15

Re: Could someone make a list of FreeBASIC GUI libraries/frameworks?

Postby systemctl » Apr 18, 2020 7:34

deltarho[1859] wrote:I am surprised that no one has mentioned José Roca's WinFBX framework yet which is 'wall to wall' SDK wrappers.


I know about it. It's very good but it's not cross platform. It's only available for Windows. This is the reason why we not yet have WinFBE for Linux.
TJF
Posts: 3612
Joined: Dec 06, 2009 22:27
Location: N47°, E15°
Contact:

Re: Could someone make a list of FreeBASIC GUI libraries/frameworks?

Postby TJF » Apr 18, 2020 8:33

systemctl wrote:From my definition it's only need to be able to build user interface without having to code by hand and allow us to bind even to like OnButtonClick, OnMouseOver... then it's enough to be a good GUI designer. RAD also includes non visible component you can drag and drop into the form that I strongly against and because of that I prefer a simple GUI designer without any non visible component. If I want to use a Timer I will call the Timer sub but not drag a non visible "TTimer" component and drop into my form. That's my reasoning.

When you start professional GUI development, you'll soon come to the point where you build your own widgets and want to use them in the GUI designer. AFAIK only Glade can handle customized widgets.

From my point of view the list of FreeBASIC GUI libraries is pretty simple, just one entry:
  • GTK + Glade3 + PoEdit
RNBW
Posts: 203
Joined: Apr 11, 2015 11:06
Location: UK

Re: Could someone make a list of FreeBASIC GUI libraries/frameworks?

Postby RNBW » Apr 18, 2020 10:39

BasicCoder2 wrote:I downloaded window9 yesterday from here but couldn't get the examples to work without compiler errors.
https://sourceforge.net/projects/guiwindow9/

Did you follow the instructions in this post https://www.freebasic.net/forum/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=17058 in respect of placing of libraries?

Windows:

1) Put files libwindow9.a, libLinked_Lists.a in the folder: compilier\lib\win32

2) Put files Linked_Lists.bi , Window9.bi in the folder: compilier\inc

In the Windows maybe need a library zlib .

Linux (with standard compiler installation):

1) Put files libwindow9.a, libLinked_Lists.a in the folder: /usr/local/lib/freebasic/linux-x86 OR /usr/local/lib/freebasic/linux-x86_64

2) Put files Linked_Lists.bi , window9.bi , keys.bi in the folder: /usr/local/include/freebasic

In the Linux may have to install dependencies from dev versions: gtk (I suggest GTK2) , zlib, webkitgtk , ...


I admit to forgetting about these when there is an update to FreeBasic.
deltarho[1859]
Posts: 2916
Joined: Jan 02, 2017 0:34
Location: UK

Re: Could someone make a list of FreeBASIC GUI libraries/frameworks?

Postby deltarho[1859] » Apr 18, 2020 11:03

systemctl wrote:I know about it. It's very good but it's not cross platform.

If someone is thinking about writing an application that both Windows members and Linux members can use then, obviously, it needs to be cross-platform. Some of my random number generators are cross-platform but were not written with that in mind; they are simply not Windows based. All my crypto work is Windows based because I wouldn't know where to start with Linux; without Wine or whatever. Most members write code for the membership.

However, if someone is thinking about writing an application with a view to publishing as shareware then look at the following:

Image

They will not get rich writing for Linux and it may not be possible to write it as cross-platform.
marcov
Posts: 3118
Joined: Jun 16, 2005 9:45
Location: Eindhoven, NL
Contact:

Re: Could someone make a list of FreeBASIC GUI libraries/frameworks?

Postby marcov » Apr 18, 2020 11:26

deltarho[1859] wrote:However, if someone is thinking about writing an application with a view to publishing as shareware then look at the following:


Shareware? The nineties called, and they want their terminology back! :P-)

Anyway, such stats are hugely misleading, since ever increasing counts of users won't ever install apps not provided by the OS, or from a familiar 25 entry list that contains things like Google software,Whatsapp,Candy Crush,skype,facebook and a few national apps for the region they live in.

Thus they are not potential audience, but they do browse to sites that are monitored by statcounter. It even narrows more if you don't count users that won't install something from outside of an appstore. How many people have a FB program in an appstore?

I see it all the time with relatives and acquaintances that used to have some PC skills now not coming further than a tablet anymore, except for a few things as annual taxes.
Lost Zergling
Posts: 410
Joined: Dec 02, 2011 22:51
Location: France

Re: Could someone make a list of FreeBASIC GUI libraries/frameworks?

Postby Lost Zergling » Apr 18, 2020 12:27

Okay, so I know I'm going against the grain of the moment by saying that, but the GUI I think is the most "critical" is the IUP wrapper made by D.J. Peters called "TinyDialog". It is the only GUI (if you can call it a GUI) which allows you to make an efficient small graphical interface without the need for either an framework or a "designer" client, nor to really learn to program an interface. The only immediately accessible solution with almost no time investment. It is very important, it is fundamental : a beginner (or not) can hack a multi platform interface in half a day without having to really learn the GUI methodology. Admittedly, it is limited, it is certainly atypical, but it is so easy! Besides, it's light.
The ultimate calling product. There is a niche for that, really, and according to my opinion it doesn't compete with FLTK nor other GUIs.
I personally find it very unfortunate that DJ Peters decided to abandon promotion and follow-up around this tool (and I also regret that the rights of use (of DJ Peters' work on the wrapper and possible access to the sources of the wrapper) might be more explicit).
marcov
Posts: 3118
Joined: Jun 16, 2005 9:45
Location: Eindhoven, NL
Contact:

Re: Could someone make a list of FreeBASIC GUI libraries/frameworks?

Postby marcov » Apr 18, 2020 12:45

systemctl wrote: . If I want to use a Timer I will call the Timer sub but not drag a non visible "TTimer" component and drop into my form. That's my reasoning.


Wanting to do it in code is not an argument for not also having it in GUI. Most hardcore Delphi devels will do everything in code in their big apps, but for a quick test or util happily use the designer. (though I'm more thinking about the non visual data components then, and not ttimer).

Timers scale bad anyway, since if for everything you need to regularly do you add another timer, you get a lot of useless polling. Most people graduate to scheduler like systems in time. But if I make a simple application to visualize the output of some embedded board and give it commands I'll happily drag a timer on the form to do some timing stuff.

But in the major apps I have maybe two timers. One is only used on startup (for the splash screen timing), and one feeds the scheduler, since I have not managed to make that entirely event driven yet.

As for the designers: for me the RAD aspect is not non visual components but seamless operating on code and gui together, without artificial separations or procedures between them
Last edited by marcov on Apr 18, 2020 14:26, edited 4 times in total.
jj2007
Posts: 2042
Joined: Oct 23, 2016 15:28
Location: Roma, Italia
Contact:

Re: Could someone make a list of FreeBASIC GUI libraries/frameworks?

Postby jj2007 » Apr 18, 2020 12:47

systemctl wrote:
deltarho[1859] wrote:I am surprised that no one has mentioned José Roca's WinFBX framework yet which is 'wall to wall' SDK wrappers.


I know about it. It's very good but it's not cross platform. It's only available for Windows. This is the reason why we not yet have WinFBE for Linux.

Would it run on Linux with Wine?
systemctl
Posts: 182
Joined: Mar 27, 2020 5:15

Re: Could someone make a list of FreeBASIC GUI libraries/frameworks?

Postby systemctl » Apr 18, 2020 15:41

jj2007 wrote:
systemctl wrote:
deltarho[1859] wrote:I am surprised that no one has mentioned José Roca's WinFBX framework yet which is 'wall to wall' SDK wrappers.


I know about it. It's very good but it's not cross platform. It's only available for Windows. This is the reason why we not yet have WinFBE for Linux.

Would it run on Linux with Wine?


I don't know. But I think it should run fine. BTW, you can only launch GUI based application from the IDE, as console application will start but you will not see the console window. It's my experience with CodeBlocks and I think WinFBE would be the same, too.
Last edited by systemctl on Apr 18, 2020 15:49, edited 1 time in total.
deltarho[1859]
Posts: 2916
Joined: Jan 02, 2017 0:34
Location: UK

Re: Could someone make a list of FreeBASIC GUI libraries/frameworks?

Postby deltarho[1859] » Apr 18, 2020 15:48

@marcov re my statcounter image.

I agree with everything that you wrote but does that explain 82.56% to 1.46%?
jj2007 wrote:Would it run on Linux with Wine?

I cannot answer that in today's environment but a few years ago I had a Windows box to my left and a Linux box to my right (Ubuntu) and I used a lot of my PowerBASIC crypto stuff on the Linux box using Wine. The Linux box was my older Windows box and that 'died' after one year with Linux. I never got into Linux again - I did not take to it.
marcov
Posts: 3118
Joined: Jun 16, 2005 9:45
Location: Eindhoven, NL
Contact:

Re: Could someone make a list of FreeBASIC GUI libraries/frameworks?

Postby marcov » Apr 18, 2020 16:21

deltarho[1859] wrote:@marcov re my statcounter image.

I agree with everything that you wrote but does that explain 82.56% to 1.46%?


No. For general purposes that is about the order I also see windows >> mac > mobile platforms > linux, I just don't really accept those stats for anything but browser related stuff, as they are intended for. But for some apps the mobile market falls out completely, no matter what the averages are.

But for a specific vertical market things can vary wildly, and it is really hard to break the market for purely shrinkwrap "sell to the whole world" apps. That market is firmly in the hand of a few big companies. So most custom development will be for vertical markets and usually B2b, not for some mythical global consumer market.

A common scenario that I see (in Delphi consulting) is having an Windows application for the big bulk of customers. Then there is occasionally demand for a Mac port for a handful but vocal lot, typically in management and marketing that for some @$&@$&*@& reason won't conform because the macbook or air is a mm thinner than the standard issue laptop. This can be both a blessing and a curse. A curse because it can be the trigger to force your main app multitarget for a small percentage of the audience, but it can also mean easy money (those departments always have spare budgets) if you are already (almost) there.

Similarly there is also occasional demand for a mobile viewer app (always iOS, rarely or never Android) for tablets for managers of customers to use in meeting and boardrooms, but that is usually less complete, and doesn't necessary have to be same codebase.

Last, but not least, there is some demand for a Linux apps, usually from government use, typically higher education (universities) and the odd research institution. Note that with universities I mostly mean the scientific personnel (graduate students , PHD students, post PHD researchers and the occasional university teacher or professor), the university's administrative processes are usually more conventional and Windows only with the odd Mac on the desktop publishing department for the University weekly or monthly rag.(*)

jj2007 wrote:Would it run on Linux with Wine?

I cannot answer that in today's environment but a few years ago I had a Windows box to my left and a Linux box to my right (Ubuntu) and I used a lot of my PowerBASIC crypto stuff on the Linux box using Wine. The Linux box was my older Windows box and that 'died' after one year with Linux. I never got into Linux again - I did not take to it.


For server apps, it is hard to avoid Linux. But for desktop it is mostly a labour of love.

But that is all based on averages. If you have research institutions and universities as major audience for your application, it can be the other way around

(*) admitted, the university scenario is a bit out of date in the sense that I don't know if Mac is still such a thing in DTP.
Last edited by marcov on Apr 18, 2020 16:30, edited 4 times in total.
dodicat
Posts: 6885
Joined: Jan 10, 2006 20:30
Location: Scotland

Re: Could someone make a list of FreeBASIC GUI libraries/frameworks?

Postby dodicat » Apr 18, 2020 16:23

Winapi functions run in Wine, but Wine is in a sandbox, it bears no relation to Linux executable files.
For instance fbedit, written in freebasic using the winapi, runs well in Linux, but it cannot compile code using a Linux installation of freebasic.
You have to have a windows fb distro unpacked somewhere.
Otherwise there would be no problem getting an ide for Linux, and that would be far too easy for freebasic users.
marcov
Posts: 3118
Joined: Jun 16, 2005 9:45
Location: Eindhoven, NL
Contact:

Re: Could someone make a list of FreeBASIC GUI libraries/frameworks?

Postby marcov » Apr 18, 2020 16:26

dodicat wrote:Winapi functions run in Wine, but Wine is in a sandbox, it bears no relation to Linux executable files.


Afaik that should be the difference between wine and application built with winelib

Return to “Community Discussion”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: ron77 and 3 guests